• ⚠️ UK Access Block Notice: Beginning July 1, 2025, this site will no longer be accessible from the United Kingdom. This is a voluntary decision made by the site's administrators. We were not forced or ordered to implement this block. If you're located in the UK, we recommend using a VPN to maintain access.

Darkover

Darkover

Archangel
Jul 29, 2021
5,628
No one asks to be born. No one signs a contract agreeing to suffer, age, struggle, and die. And yet here we are—dragged into existence by the choices of others, forced to endure the fallout of a decision we never consented to. Life is not a gift. It's a gamble. Worse—it's a gamble with someone else's chips. Procreation is the act of betting everything on the life of another, with no way to refund the pain if it goes wrong. It's a god-like decision made by people with no god-like control. And the ones who suffer most are the ones who had no say.

The moment you're born, you're sentenced. Your lungs burn for air, your body starts needing constant care, and the world around you begins to make demands. You didn't consent to this. You were thrown in. Now it's your responsibility to survive, to perform, to navigate a hostile planet with a decaying body and a fragile mind. You suffer injuries, hunger, heartbreak, and decay—not because you chose to risk it all, but because someone else did it on your behalf.

That is the brutal truth of birth: someone else rolls the dice, and you're the one who bleeds if it lands wrong.

Having children means gambling with the welfare of someone else. It means conducting Frankenstein experiments you can't control, in which someone else pays the price. You bring a new life into a chaotic world—flawed, unstable, violent—without knowing who this person will become, what they will suffer, how they will break. You don't know if they'll be born with chronic pain, mental illness, or paralyzing trauma. You don't know if they'll want to die by age 15, or be crushed under the weight of poverty, rejection, or meaningless labor. But you gamble anyway.

To create life is to play god. But unlike a god, you have no control over outcomes. You can't guarantee safety, joy, or justice. You can't promise love, health, or peace. You bring a person into being without their permission, and then hope it works out. That's not love. That's reckless. That's insanity dressed up as tradition.

No one is born into a clean slate. You're born into a broken world—into systems you didn't design and can't opt out of. Capitalism, debt, war, climate collapse—this is your inheritance. You must work to live, and often suffer to work. You are disposable, replaceable, and constantly judged by your productivity. You exist in a world where rent is higher than wages, where depression is epidemic, where nature is dying, and where connection is more digital than human.

You didn't make these systems. You don't benefit from them. But you are forced to survive within them—or die trying.

Reproduction isn't just biological—it's psychological. Parents pass on their fears, their expectations, their wounds. Most never heal before having kids. They dump their unfinished business into new, innocent vessels. The child becomes the extension, the projection, the emotional caretaker. You're raised not as a free being, but as a reflection of your parents' unresolved selves.

Maybe they love you. Maybe they try. But love doesn't undo damage. Intentions don't erase trauma. The price is still yours to carry.

The world is burning. Literally. The air is poisoned, the oceans are dying, and ecosystems are collapsing. You were born into this mess, and now you're told it's your job to fix it. You're expected to find meaning in a collapsing biosphere while corporations and governments extract the last drops of life from the Earth. And while you're doing that, you must also stay positive, find love, succeed, and not fall apart.

This is what you inherit when someone else chooses to procreate: a future on fire and no map out.

Even if you want to reject this imposed existence, you're punished. Talk about suicide, and you're pathologized. Refuse to participate, and you're labeled lazy or broken. Society forces you to keep going, no matter the cost, and condemns anyone who questions the morality of forced existence. Opting out of life is treated as a defect, even though entering life without consent is treated as normal.

You're trapped. Not just by your biology, but by social shame, legal barriers, and emotional blackmail.

Let's be clear. Creating life is not a neutral act. It is not inherently good. It is a high-stakes decision with irreversible consequences for someone else. And when that decision is made carelessly—or even lovingly, but naively—it can lead to lifetimes of suffering, confusion, and despair. The one who makes the choice never pays the full price. The one who is born does.

To procreate is to gamble with someone else's mind, body, and future. It is to conduct a Frankenstein experiment with no ethical oversight. It is to play god with human lives while having none of the power or foresight that a god would require.

And the child? They become the collateral damage of hope, of tradition, of vanity, of loneliness, of unexamined desire. They grow up paying the price for a choice they never made—a price that can include anything from chronic suffering to early death.

In a sane world, this would be unthinkable. In ours, it's just another Tuesday.
 
  • Like
  • Love
  • Hugs
Reactions: tvojamamka, 50decadesleft, coked_pigeon and 22 others
S

ScarletTanager

Member
Jul 11, 2024
17
This is a brutal assessment of life and an unforgiving critique of the living. Such a glass half empty philosophy will never admit the pleasantries and persuasions of daily life are worthy to enjoy and noble to cherish.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ccoki17, quietwoods and Grog
Zanmato

Zanmato

Student
Apr 4, 2024
153
I've made many mistakes, and I will make more.

But at least, I won't make the mistake of having a child
 
  • Like
  • Love
Reactions: tvojamamka, 50decadesleft, brokencookie and 8 others
SilentSadness

SilentSadness

Sleepy.
Feb 28, 2023
1,407
Opting out of life is treated as a defect, even though entering life without consent is treated as normal.
Very true sadly, most people are so desperate to believe that life is good that they will bend over backwards to deny its flaws.
This is a brutal assessment of life and an unforgiving critique of the living. Such a glass half empty philosophy will never admit the pleasantries and persuasions of daily life are worthy to enjoy and noble to cherish.
Basically ignores every point that the original poster made, congratulations.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Life'sA6itch, Darkover, laurenrose and 2 others
divinemistress36

divinemistress36

Angelic
Jan 1, 2024
4,713
Our parents decided to fuck without condoms , pass their shitty genetics to us then expect us to just deal with the Hell of the world cause they were horny and/or wanted a fantasy of children fullfilling them
 
  • Like
  • Aww..
  • Informative
Reactions: 50decadesleft, brokencookie, Darkover and 11 others
Pluto

Pluto

Cat Extremist
Dec 27, 2020
5,139
6yzh7f.jpg
 
  • Like
  • Yay!
Reactions: EmptyBottle, Life'sA6itch, brokencookie and 6 others
L

Life'sA6itch

Lights out please
Oct 29, 2023
322
This is a brutal assessment of life and an unforgiving critique of the living. Such a glass half empty philosophy will never admit the pleasantries and persuasions of daily life are worthy to enjoy and noble to cherish.
But what of those of us with no pleasantries in daily/life? I agree with their description.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: brokencookie, Darkover and Hollowman
N

Nauyaca

Member
Apr 18, 2025
38
"This is my father's crime against me, which I myself committed against none"

-Abu al-ʿAlaʾ al-Maʿarri (Abulola Moarrensis)
Born 973, died 1057

Sane people have been telling this a thousand years before us and it still falls on deaf ears.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EmptyBottle, SilentSadness, brokencookie and 6 others
F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
12,209
I think that life/ children are a 'gift' that would-be parents decide to give to themselves. Or, they were careless maybe. Again, pleasing themselves with sex without considering the consequences. Or, it was all a mistake and this world forced them to continue with it.

I agree though. If raising children was purely a selfless act to help an individual grow in this world then surely, more people would be open to adoption. A lot aren't though. They want to replicate themselves and their partners.

I actually hate it that I've lived this long to grow so bitter. After a while, I began to blame God for how this world was designed. But then, when I wondered whether there even was a God, it seemed more logical to turn to my parents. They definitely did and do exist. They definitely struggled in life too. I simply don't believe it was all wine and roses back then. They complain about how their life was so much harder than mine. It just defies logic then- to me anyway. Why bring a being here to endure the same? Especially one you purport to love.
 
  • Like
Reactions: brokencookie and Darkover
S

ScarletTanager

Member
Jul 11, 2024
17
I'm so sorry, I don't know why but this thread is making me laugh, maybe it's the cat post, fur real…have a good day everyone, if that is possible!
 
  • Like
  • Hugs
Reactions: EmptyBottle, ccoki17 and Darkover
L

Ligottian

Enlightened
Dec 19, 2021
1,018
For a list of antinatalist quotes, go to wikiquote.org and type in antinatalism.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EmptyBottle and Darkover
Paizen

Paizen

Student
Feb 5, 2025
106
The only thing I would disagree with is that there is no such thing as meaningless labor. It sucks to labor for someone else and only scrape the pennies off your labor, but even slaveshops in China produce goods that maybe some half-decent person will get to own and do something good with. I'm not actually anti-natalist either, I just think if you're going to have children, make sure you're ready, willing and able to fucking raise them. And don't just throw them on the streets unless they can afford to pay rent. Many humans are just walking pieces of shit. Happy Fathers day, Asshole.
 
  • Like
Reactions: quietwoods, divinemistress36 and Darkover
dust-in-the-wind

dust-in-the-wind

Animal Lover
Aug 24, 2024
693
Well written assessment of the truth of life. I am 56 years old and made the conscious choice not to have children.
 
  • Like
  • Love
Reactions: 50decadesleft, divinemistress36, Life'sA6itch and 2 others
T

tulero

Member
Mar 20, 2025
61
all truths
 
  • Like
Reactions: 50decadesleft, Life'sA6itch, brokencookie and 1 other person
ketopia

ketopia

Missing my Mom
Jun 4, 2025
84
My mom even told me that even though she loved me and my brother very much, she would have chosen to not have children if she knew what this world was heading towards.

Now I feel the opposite, where she's gone and im glad she doesn't have to hear about the news anymore. She passed away October 8th 2023. Let that sink in. I literally felt like I entered the Bad Reality the moment she passed away
 
  • Hugs
  • Like
Reactions: EmptyBottle, Life'sA6itch and Darkover
L

Life'sA6itch

Lights out please
Oct 29, 2023
322
"This is my father's crime against me, which I myself committed against none"

-Abu al-ʿAlaʾ al-Maʿarri (Abulola Moarrensis)
Born 973, died 1057

Sane people have been telling this a thousand years before us and it still falls on deaf ears.
Or worse, they're labeled as insane or some kind of threat
 
  • Like
  • Love
  • Informative
Reactions: Ligottian, EmptyBottle, Nauyaca and 2 others
L

Life'sA6itch

Lights out please
Oct 29, 2023
322
Well written assessment of the truth of life. I am 56 years old and made the conscious choice not to have children.
Same here. I look around at the absolute struggles parents and so many children go through is needless AND rampant. Adding insult to injury, these same people often expect chair children to take care of them after providing bad childhoods.
 
dust-in-the-wind

dust-in-the-wind

Animal Lover
Aug 24, 2024
693
Same here. I look around at the absolute struggles parents and so many children go through is needless AND rampant. Adding insult to injury, these same people often expect chair children to take care of them after providing bad childhoods.
When I was younger and married people used to ask when we would have children and I would tell them never. Got called selfish a few times, which is quite the opposite. It is selfish to have children for your own needs and desires. The other question I would be asked is who would take care of me when I old? Like having children is a guarantee they will there for you, hahaha. Just ask the lonely people in nursing homes who's kids hardly visit.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NoPoint2Life, Life'sA6itch and divinemistress36
sanction

sanction

sanctioned
Mar 15, 2019
644
When I was younger and married people used to ask when we would have children and I would tell them never. Got called selfish a few times, which is quite the opposite. It is selfish to have children for your own needs and desires. The other question I would be asked is who would take care of me when I old? Like having children is a guarantee they will there for you, hahaha. Just ask the lonely people in nursing homes who's kids hardly visit.
I truly don't understand how people come to the logic of not having kids is in any way, shape, or form tied to selfishness

This is a genuine question and confusion of mine. Does anyone have the answer how they came to that conclusion?

I don't mean to sound rude or disrespectful, but seems like people who thinks like that truly are lacking even some basic level of common sense or intelligence

And it's not even about it being a good or bad idea to procreate

It's more of I just can't seem to connect the dots (in any logical sense) that being child-free is able to be related to selfishness lol

Because who (or what) is it exactly affecting?? Lol

Someone please explain. Thanks
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Life'sA6itch, dust-in-the-wind and divinemistress36
F

frayed

Member
Jun 6, 2025
63
I truly don't understand how people come to the logic of not having kids is in any way, shape, or form tied to selfishness
i've heard parents demand grandchildren
perhaps for their own entertainment idk
getting old is a lonely business
 
sanction

sanction

sanctioned
Mar 15, 2019
644
i've heard parents demand grandchildren
perhaps for their own entertainment idk
getting old is a lonely business
So in their mentality, if not being selfish for themselves, is considered selfish??

Although I kind of get what you mean, but at the same time still confused lol

Just seems like a very shit quality type of mentality / way of thought process

It's like.... in order to not be "selifsh", then the solution is to first be "selfish", by only considering my own personal benefit, and not consider the benefit of the other innocent human

And its only by being selfish in this specific way, which will then result in making myself actually not selfish in the very end.

Damn..... its kind of hurting my brain to try to process and understand this twisted logic lol... it's like I'm trying to solve some complicated trick question or riddle lol

In my opinion, the wrong word (selfish) has been used for too many years. Maybe the better term they should instead use is, it is considered "disrespectful" to your parents for not having kids, since it will mean they can't enjoy being a grandparent. I believe "selfish" is the wrong word for this. But oh wells.... lol
 
Last edited:
F

frayed

Member
Jun 6, 2025
63
So in their mentality, if not being selfish for themselves, is considered selfish??

Although I kind of get what you mean, but at the same time still confused lol

Just seems like a very shit quality type of mentality / way of thought process

It's like.... in order to not be "selifsh", then the solution is to first be "selfish", by only considering my own personal benefit, and not consider the benefit of the other innocent human

And its only by being selfish in this specific way, which will then result in making myself actually not selfish in the very end.

Damn..... its kind of hurting my brain to try to understand this twisted logic lol... it's like I'm trying to solve some complicated trick question or riddle lol

yeah, they think they deserve it
the least their children can do for them
it's very idiotic and backwards
but who's gonna tell them that?
most people just submit to it
useless authority figures
babies are mostly just a commodity, people hardly ever think about them as sentient human beings
even those that profess great love for their offspring
perhaps they are not evil, not always, but they are certainly very dumb to not realize the gravity of giving birth
 
  • Like
Reactions: sanction
sanction

sanction

sanctioned
Mar 15, 2019
644
yeah, they think they deserve it
the least their children can do for them
it's very idiotic and backwards
but who's gonna tell them that?
most people just submit to it
useless authority figures
babies are mostly just a commodity, people hardly ever think about them as sentient human beings
even those that profess great love for their offspring
perhaps they are not evil, not always, but they are certainly very dumb to not realize the gravity of giving birth
Yes agreed

Usually 99% (or at least over 90%) of parents are not evil, and had kids without any bad intentions. It's just that they didn't know better at first. And unfortunately by the time they realize the negative part, it was already too late

But still, it's hard to be forgiven. I compare it to unintentionally causing an accident towards another person by mistake, and now that other person is disabled and handicapped for life

Although it wasn't intentional, it was indeed still a big and serious mistake that caused direct harm to another innocent individual in the end

So regardless, it is still a very serious matter and responsibility, whether it was intentional or not
 
F

frayed

Member
Jun 6, 2025
63
Yes agreed

Usually 99% (or at least over 90%) of parents are not evil, and had kids without any bad intentions. It's just that they didn't know better at first. And unfortunately by the time they realize the negative part, it was already too late

But still, it's hard to be forgiven. I compare it to unintentionally causing an accident towards another person by mistake, and now that other person is disabled and handicapped for life

Although it wasn't intentional, it was indeed still a big and serious mistake that caused direct harm to another innocent individual in the end

So regardless, it is still a very serious matter and responsibility, whether it was intentional or not
there's no pressure from the society for them to take responsibility
most people haven't even heard about anti natalism
it's a society that celebrates a woman giving birth
anti natalists are seen as godless abominations
 
  • Like
Reactions: sanction
sanction

sanction

sanctioned
Mar 15, 2019
644
there's no pressure from the society for them to take responsibility
most people haven't even heard about anti natalism
it's a society that celebrates a woman giving birth
anti natalists are seen as godless abominations
Exactly

Unfortunately whenever someone announces being pregnant or having a baby, the automatic reaction / first response is always "congratulations".

Society has definitely been brainwashed
 
F

frayed

Member
Jun 6, 2025
63
Society has definitely been brainwashed
nothing has changed
it has ensured the survival of the human species since the beginning of times
 
  • Like
Reactions: EmptyBottle, silentnights56 and sanction
NewtBoy

NewtBoy

Member
Nov 7, 2023
21
This is a brutal assessment of life and an unforgiving critique of the living. Such a glass half empty philosophy will never admit the pleasantries and persuasions of daily life are worthy to enjoy and noble to cherish.
"Noble to cherish"? Why? Yeah it's a brutal assessment for sure, but it's the truth. Not to mention that for a lot of people, these pleasantries and persuasions don't really exist. The fact that the only guarantees in life are death, decay, and suffering persists. In addition, nobody can consent to being here for any of it. This is all irrefutable fact, not flowery rhetoric to coddle oneself. No, the philosophy definitely doesn't "admit" to these things, because they are the exception, not the rule.
 
  • Like
  • Hugs
Reactions: EmptyBottle, silentnights56 and sanction
sanction

sanction

sanctioned
Mar 15, 2019
644
"Noble to cherish"? Why? Yeah it's a brutal assessment for sure, but it's the truth. Not to mention that for a lot of people, these pleasantries and persuasions don't really exist. The fact that the only guarantees in life are death, decay, and suffering persists. In addition, nobody can consent to being here for any of it. This is all irrefutable fact, not flowery rhetoric to coddle oneself. No, the philosophy definitely doesn't "admit" to these things, because they are the exception, not the rule.
Agreed. The good simply outweighs the bad for majority of people. Therefore, it is what it is.

"The truth always hurts"
 
  • Like
Reactions: NewtBoy

Similar threads

davidtorez
Replies
4
Views
236
Politics & Philosophy
davidtorez
davidtorez
Darkover
Replies
12
Views
272
Suicide Discussion
wham311
W
Darkover
Replies
7
Views
333
Suicide Discussion
Hollowman
H