Method When is jumping immoral? How to make it moral?

[TokaNoOwari]

@SoLowHollow48 brought up morals in connection to a different method than mine in one of my previous posts.
While my method is jumping off buildings and not in front of a train, it did spark these moral questions of mine again that I can't seem to stop thinking about for days.

[...] I commented on how jumping in front of a train is a bad idea [...] They're going to have to go down there, gather your limbs, wash your blood off the tracks, and divert the passengers to the exit to get themselves a ride on another vehicle or commuter line [...] Show sympathy but don't overlook the impact the victim caused too. [...]

I have been struggling to process something similar for many years, and I would really value some outside perspectives on it.
I grew up in a big city and went to a school with an incredibly oppressive environment. We unfortunately lost several students during my time there to jumping/falling suicides. Because I was also struggling immensely back then, I very much understood the suffocating despair they were feeling and why they just wanted a way out of this torture camp. However, one of the incidents involved a girl who fell and tragically killed innocent passersby in the process. It terrified me. While admittedly I was quite young at the time, I never considered this possibility.

Ever since then, I have been completely torn apart morally, and never dared to try again. I have deep empathy for the pain she was in, but I cannot reconcile it with the reality that she made a choice that physically endangered, and in the end killed, unaware strangers and forced a highly traumatic scene on everyday people. I am very torn on how to feel about it.

Even worse, I was about to make the same choice just a couple of weeks before her, but I stepped away from the edge in the end. I never went further than trying to figure out the tipping point before gravity would have done the rest of my job. It was an experience to say the least.

Disclaimer me romanticising suicide: As far as I can think back, falling was my number one method. It actually still is, as I find the idea of flying incredibly serene and liberating. I just can't figure out how I could even pull it off without tearing apart my own moral compass. The city reaches out further than I can see, is incredibly crowded, and even if I leave the city, what then? Where do I go? Break in on a railway bridge only to end up falling on a tree and be crippled? It feels impossible to do, especially since RedBull removed its flying perk. (Sorry, I had to)

How the fuck would I even reliably kill myself by jumping with such heavy limitations? Anybody got some input or thoughts on this whole topic? Pro and con are welcome.
I'm overwhelmed.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I suppose- like all methods, there are varying amounts of immorality to them. As in- we can try to limit the amount of people who might be traumatized/ witness it. By choosing more remote locations at times when people aren't around so much for example. Even if jumping is the prefered method- jumping into water from great height would seem less likely to cause injury to others than jumping from a building in an urban area in rush hour.

I still think that research is really important though. I have considered jumping but then, I've also seen disturbing reports of people surviving but with terrible injuries in the locations I've considered.

I suspect all suicides cause some distress but then- I think there's also the argument that our societies have brought that on themselves. I'm sure most people would much rather pass peacefully and out of sight but, those options are often denied us. While I do think it's resonsible to consider the impact on others, I also think people should realise that when you corner a desperate creature- it will lash out to try to escape.

 

[TokaNoOwari]

I suppose- like all methods, there are varying amounts of immorality to them. As in- we can try to limit the amount of people who might be traumatized/ witness it. By choosing more remote locations at times when people aren't around so much for example. Even if jumping is the prefered method- jumping into water from great height would seem less likely to cause injury to others than jumping from a building in an urban area in rush hour.

There is actually a high bridge, infamous for suicides, spanning above the water. A year ago, I went there, but it seems like it is completely suicide-proofed nowadays by metal mesh fencing running all along the walkable areas and plenty of safeguards preventing other ways on top of that bridge. Jumping into water, however, is a great option. I will have a look around if there are any other bridges that are high enough. Might be tricky since I don't want to take any risks by choosing only a semi-high bridge.

I suspect all suicides cause some distress but then- I think there's also the argument that our societies have brought that on themselves. I'm sure most people would much rather pass peacefully and out of sight but, those options are often denied us. While I do think it's resonsible to consider the impact on others, I also think people should realise that when you corner a desperate creature- it will lash out to try to escape.

I very much agree with that. There needs to be an actual balance that takes both sides into account. At least here, there isn't really any understanding towards the suicidal person. We are, for the most part, isolated and silenced by society. Though I could just slash my neck with a tanto. Somehow, that is seen as good. Well, maybe not as much nowadays. :D

 

[Forever Sleep]

There is actually a high bridge, infamous for suicides, spanning above the water. A year ago, I went there, but it seems like it is completely suicide-proofed nowadays by metal mesh fencing running all along the walkable areas and plenty of safeguards preventing other ways on top of that bridge. Jumping into water, however, is a great option. I will have a look around if there are any other bridges that are high enough. Might be tricky since I don't want to take any risks by choosing only a semi-high bridge.


I very much agree with that. There needs to be an actual balance that takes both sides into account. At least here, there isn't really any understanding towards the suicidal person. We are, for the most part, isolated and silenced by society. Though I could just slash my neck with a tanto. Somehow, that is seen as good. Well, maybe not as much nowadays. :D

It's terrifying that we feel driven to such actions. Do definitely research it. Jumping feels too scary for me. Not just the (undoubtably) huge SI to overcome but the dangers of only maiming ourselves badly.

 

[Intoxicated]

While my method is jumping off buildings and not in front of a train

At least, you shouldn't kill others. This is not good:

Spoiler: TW: Graphic Images. Suicide.

Suicide Jumper Lands On A Baby Stroller

Click To Watch

www.livegore.com

 

[RedFruit]

At least, you shouldn't kill others. This is not good:

Spoiler: TW: Graphic Images. Suicide.

Suicide Jumper Lands On A Baby Stroller

Click To Watch

www.livegore.com

This was so sad to see omg good reason to jump at night/in an isolated area.

 

[Matchaaa]

I believe that as long as the act of suicide does not physically harm others, there is no issue with it.
I know that no matter what method is used, it will cause psychological trauma to those who discover the body, because most of the time, they do not want to witness such a scene. But I think this is a problem caused by society, not because the person who takes their own life is immoral. This is because all forms of euthanasia/assisted dying are either illegal or have extremely high barriers to access. I believe that once a well-regulated euthanasia system is made available, most people would not want to die in agony.

 

[SoverignDreamer97]

For one thing: "You can't please everyone, and can only control the things you can control." ~Suncha

Beyond that, you probably shouldn't concern yourself with what happens after you die, since you'll already be dead— unless it's the afterlife you're worried about, in which case, what's it to you that there is one, given that without faith it is impossible to please Him; that all who come to God must believe that He is, and that He's a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him? (Hebrews 11:6)

If you are without faith, and have no desire to seek God, or to have anything to do with Him, His followers, or Christianity itself, then you shouldn't worry about whether or not the biblical claims are true; so long as you believe not on the Son, you're going to be separated from Him and His followers regardless.

For God so loved the world He gave His only begotten Son, Christ Jesus of Nazareth; He died on the cross, His blood was shed for the remission of sins, and then He rose on the third day, that whosoever believes on Him shall not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.

"He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God." (John 3:16-21)

But if you don't want to be separated from Him, then by all means believe, for suicide is not a sin that leads to separation, but rather unbelief.

Whatever the case, it doesn't matter.

 

[TokaNoOwari]

At least, you shouldn't kill others. This is not good:

How not to kill others is the whole point of this post. I completely agree with you.

On that note, sharing such a video, of I assume a toddler dying or getting seriously injured, without a disclaimer or censoring in any way, is quite upsetting, in my opinion.

 

[Intoxicated]

How not to kill others is the whole point of this post.

How not to kill others: by ensuring that the unsafe area below is clear and nobody can enter it suddenly (possibly using transport and/or from places you can't see) during the time needed for you to reach the ground. If you can't evaluate this well, then you could consider different methods that don't put others at risk.

On that note, sharing such a video, of I assume a toddler dying or getting seriously injured, without a disclaimer or censoring in any way, is quite upsetting, in my opinion.

People should see possible devastating consequences in all their ugliness. There are quite a lot of cases when suicidal jumpers kill random people like f..ing terrorists

Spoiler: TW: Graphic images. Suicide.

Suicide Jumper Lands on Guy on His Phone

Click To Watch

www.livegore.com

Suicide Jumper Fall On Passer-by Woman Killing Himself And The Poor Woman

Click To Watch

www.livegore.com

Suicide Jumper Takes Out Woman

Click To Watch

www.livegore.com

Woman killed as suicide jumper lands on her | News24

A woman in Hong Kong has been killed after a woman committing suicide by jumping from a building landed on top of her, police say.

www.news24.com

Suicide jumper lands on elderly woman

An elderly person walking down a Manhattan sidewalk was injured when a suicide jumper landed on them.

www.fox26houston.com

'Girl killed by suicide jumper'

A seven-year-old South Korean girl was killed instantly after being struck by the body of a man as he plunged from his tenth-floor apartment in an apparent suicide, a report said. The 40-year-old man jumped from the flat in the southern port of Busan on Wednesday evening and hit the daughter of...

www.sowetan.co.za

Woman dies after man jumps from parking garage and lands on top of her

The tragedy occurred just a week shy of the woman's 30th birthday.

www.nbcnews.com

Suicidal Jumper Lands On Bystander Killing Both: Police

A 25-year-old man jumped off the roof of a building, falling 12 stories and landing on a 61-year-old man, Yonkers police said.

patch.com

Pedestrian killed by suicide jumper

A woman who committed suicide by jumping out of an eighth floor window killed a pedestrian who was walking along the street below, Spanish police said on Wednesday.

web.archive.org

Woman Killed After 12-Year-Old Boy Jumps Off I-66 Overpass, Lands on Her SUV

A 12-year-old boy plunged from an overpass in Virginia in an apparent suicide attempt on Saturday, killing a woman who was driving her SUV on the interstate below, police say.

www.nbcwashington.com

Woman dies after man jumps off Southern California freeway, lands on her vehicle

A woman died earlier this month after a man jumped off the 210 Freeway in Los Angeles and landed on the vehicle she was in.

abc30.com

Suicides by train are innocent in comparison to this shit.

 

[TokaNoOwari]

People should see possible devastating consequences in all their ugliness. There are quite a lot of cases when suicidal jumpers kill random people like f..ing terrorists

I tried my best to look past your words. I tried to move on and ignore my trembling heart. But I won't.

@Intoxicated — You sit there acting righteous about the trauma inflicted on innocent people, yet you have no problem forcing that exact same trauma onto everyone here. You posted those videos without a single warning, stripping away our choice to look away. You are actively choosing to be the very thing you claim to despise.

You have no idea what you are actually showing. You use this gore like a cheap prop to win an argument, but I lived it. I was the innocent bystander. I smelled the sharp, burning sting of blood as it ran down the walkway in little rivers. I saw the bones of someone I cared about sticking out at places I did not even know were possible. I had to look at pieces of a human skull scattered meters away like shards of a broken vase. I stood there waiting for a leg bent so far backward to just snap back into place like a rubber band, but it never did. I saw a person I knew turned into an unrecognizable thing.

That was my friend. That horrific scene was a real human being, and the trauma of witnessing it is something I carry every single day. Using that exact nightmare imagery as a shock tactic to prove a point online is completely vile. You want people to see the ugly consequences, but you are the one inflicting them right now. I despise you for doing this. You are no better than the jumpers you call terrorists, forcing your violence on people who never asked to see it.

(To the moderation team: I am incredibly sorry in advance for the graphic language and raw anger in this comment. The unprompted videos triggered a very real and personal trauma for me, but I sincerely apologize for the trouble this causes you to moderate.)

Edit: I want to thank the moderation team for stepping in. Putting those videos behind a spoiler with a trigger warning really helps ensure that no one else has to be exposed to gore without choosing to. Thank you for looking out for us.

 

[Intoxicated]

You posted those videos without a single warning, stripping away our choice to look away.

The name of the first link - "Suicide Jumper Lands On A Baby Stroller" - speaks for itself; other links have unambiguously self-explanatory titles as well. What else could you expect to see there? Cute kittens falling on people from trees? Perhaps, I just overestimate common sense in people, if such things need additional explanation.

 

[Thia]

Perhaps, I just overestimate common sense in people, if such things need additional explanation.

Against the new site rules. Can't link without trigger warnings.

 

[interna]

The name of the first link - "Suicide Jumper Lands On A Baby Stroller" - speaks for itself; other links have unambiguously self-explanatory titles as well. What else could you expect to see there? Cute kittens falling on people from trees? Perhaps, I just overestimate common sense in people, if such things need additional explanation.

when someone goes through that traumatic of an event, just the mention of it alone can trigger a spiral. the titles themselves are pretty descriptive in that regard. plus the fact that these links have thumbnails lol.

you aren't desensitizing anyone; people here are already pretty desensitized & know the full extent of the consequences, which is why you see so much hesitation to ctb.

 

[Intoxicated]

people here are already pretty desensitized & know the full extent of the consequences, which is why you see so much hesitation to ctb.

While emotional harm to other people is often unavoidable when committing suicide, causing physical harm to others is an entirely new level of negative consequences, and it's commonly avoidable if the person puts efforts in finding actual solutions for this issue. But seeking for such solutions may be a less comfortable path than seeking for validation of choosing an outright dangerous way that seems handy.

 

[LostHighway]

Do not jump in a spot where you might injure someone or where someone could easily find you. I hope to jump at night and alert paramedics beforehand so that clean up could be done before any passersby don't see my remains.

 

[Front Back]

@SoLowHollow48 brought up morals in connection to a different method than mine in one of my previous posts.
While my method is jumping off buildings and not in front of a train, it did spark these moral questions of mine again that I can't seem to stop thinking about for days.


I have been struggling to process something similar for many years, and I would really value some outside perspectives on it.
I grew up in a big city and went to a school with an incredibly oppressive environment. We unfortunately lost several students during my time there to jumping/falling suicides. Because I was also struggling immensely back then, I very much understood the suffocating despair they were feeling and why they just wanted a way out of this torture camp. However, one of the incidents involved a girl who fell and tragically killed innocent passersby in the process. It terrified me. While admittedly I was quite young at the time, I never considered this possibility.

Ever since then, I have been completely torn apart morally, and never dared to try again. I have deep empathy for the pain she was in, but I cannot reconcile it with the reality that she made a choice that physically endangered, and in the end killed, unaware strangers and forced a highly traumatic scene on everyday people. I am very torn on how to feel about it.

Even worse, I was about to make the same choice just a couple of weeks before her, but I stepped away from the edge in the end. I never went further than trying to figure out the tipping point before gravity would have done the rest of my job. It was an experience to say the least.

Disclaimer me romanticising suicide: As far as I can think back, falling was my number one method. It actually still is, as I find the idea of flying incredibly serene and liberating. I just can't figure out how I could even pull it off without tearing apart my own moral compass. The city reaches out further than I can see, is incredibly crowded, and even if I leave the city, what then? Where do I go? Break in on a railway bridge only to end up falling on a tree and be crippled? It feels impossible to do, especially since RedBull removed its flying perk. (Sorry, I had to)

How the fuck would I even reliably kill myself by jumping with such heavy limitations? Anybody got some input or thoughts on this whole topic? Pro and con are welcome.
I'm overwhelmed.

By not letting other see. Alert the medic and jump at night, preferably water or like cliff so no driver involved

 

[windowinstaller]

make sure not to hit anything on the way down.