Charlie Kirk shot at campus event in Utah

[Dejected 55]

I've been clear that I don't like what I know about Charlie Kirk, but didn't want to see him killed for it and I don't like seeing people cheering it.

Not equal events, but I don't like the implication of the Jimmy Kimmel suspension either. I'm not particularly a fan of his show. I was not a fan of "The Man Show" back in the day as I thought it exemplified the worst aspects of men in society.

Curiously... there are woman who are liberal who will defend Kimmel now, but I don't think they would have defended him for things he said and did on "The Man Show" back in the day. That's interesting to me.

Meanwhile, I see a lot of people on the right cheering at Kimmel's suspension. That kind of gets a meh from me because cancel culture has hit both sides at various times and each side cheers far too much at it. Sometimes I think it is just, others not so much... and this time it is less about defending Kimmel than it is about the look that this might have been instigated by FCC comments related to a potential NexStar merger among other things... which makes it less a case of cancel culture and more a potential 1st Amendment Rights issue. Which is ironic, considering Charlie Kirk was an advocate (by all accounts) of free speech, so people using his memory to cheer for potentially violating the 1st Amendment is odd.

Meanwhile... there are some people on the left who think people on the right shouldn't be cheering for Kimmel's suspension... which is weird, because some of them are the same people who thought it was okay to cheer an assassination. So... it's "okay" to cheer an assassination of someone you dislike who said something you don't like... but it's not okay for them to cheer a firing/suspension/cancellation of someone you like for something he said? I mean, at least Kimmel is still around to defend himself... something Kirk cannot do.

As for what Kimmel said. I don't think what Kimmel said was offensive. He was giving his opinion on his entertainment show. BUT... I do think what he said was dangerous in this regard. People of all walks of life get news and updates on current events through talk shows and even shows on Comedy Central (different topic) sometimes as much as they do the news. Late Night Talk Shows have a tradition of the "opening monologue" that is often a mix of jokes AND serious commentary about the day's events. Hosts go on after a tragedy, like say 9/11 or a school shooting, and give a serious statement about the day. People appreciate that.

But... Kimmel, in his monologue, said things that were just not true and he said them in a way that implied he knew them as truth and not as his opinion. He gave commentary about the shooter and claimed the shooter was definitely someone on the right and then made comments beyond that extrapolating from that assertion. The thing is, that was not a known fact at the time. It was rumor and speculation. Far too many news outlets were guilty of speculation and desperately wanting the shooter to be "the enemy" so they could ride a high horse... but facts were not known... and once the shooter was caught, a very different picture than statements like Kimmel made were found to be truth.

Retractions and apologies never make as big of a splash as the initial incorrect statements. I think Kimmel was irresponsible for saying what he said at the time he said it. IF he were a news anchor then I would 100% be in favor of his firing over that kind of statement. There are other anchors in other places I would say the same about, but this is not the post for that. I will note that MSNBC did apparently fire one anchor for comments made on the day of Kirk's shooting... so there's that at least.

But with Kimmel being a talk show host... I think that gives him some leeway to be stupid and ignorant and say shit he shouldn't have said. Which is why this gets dangerous. This wasn't a case of Disney or ABC suspending him because they didn't like his monologue. This smells more like a case of NexTel, who owns a lot of ABC affiliates and who is in talks for a big merger to become the largest owner of local stations in the country... NexTel threatened to pull Kimmel's show off their ABC affiliates unless Disney/ABC did something... because NexTel doesn't want the FCC to be against their upcoming merger... and Disney/ABC already had a settlement giving money to Trump over a previous thing so they don't want a part in anything potentially dodgy so they capitulated. And it doesn't help that after the Colbert/Paramount thing when Trump cheered that and said "Kimmel is next" and here we are with Kimmel next...

Everything is so fucking intertwined and the fuckery is all over so it is hard to keep track of all the nuance going on right now... but it's hard to find a lot of "good guys" when you look around the landscape... and it honestly seems like a lot of people kind of want to see the world burn right now, on all sides.

 

[ConfettiSpaghetti]

I've been clear that I don't like what I know about Charlie Kirk, but didn't want to see him killed for it and I don't like seeing people cheering it.

Not equal events, but I don't like the implication of the Jimmy Kimmel suspension either. I'm not particularly a fan of his show. I was not a fan of "The Man Show" back in the day as I thought it exemplified the worst aspects of men in society.

Curiously... there are woman who are liberal who will defend Kimmel now, but I don't think they would have defended him for things he said and did on "The Man Show" back in the day. That's interesting to me.

Meanwhile, I see a lot of people on the right cheering at Kimmel's suspension. That kind of gets a meh from me because cancel culture has hit both sides at various times and each side cheers far too much at it. Sometimes I think it is just, others not so much... and this time it is less about defending Kimmel than it is about the look that this might have been instigated by FCC comments related to a potential NexStar merger among other things... which makes it less a case of cancel culture and more a potential 1st Amendment Rights issue. Which is ironic, considering Charlie Kirk was an advocate (by all accounts) of free speech, so people using his memory to cheer for potentially violating the 1st Amendment is odd.

Meanwhile... there are some people on the left who think people on the right shouldn't be cheering for Kimmel's suspension... which is weird, because some of them are the same people who thought it was okay to cheer an assassination. So... it's "okay" to cheer an assassination of someone you dislike who said something you don't like... but it's not okay for them to cheer a firing/suspension/cancellation of someone you like for something he said? I mean, at least Kimmel is still around to defend himself... something Kirk cannot do.

As for what Kimmel said. I don't think what Kimmel said was offensive. He was giving his opinion on his entertainment show. BUT... I do think what he said was dangerous in this regard. People of all walks of life get news and updates on current events through talk shows and even shows on Comedy Central (different topic) sometimes as much as they do the news. Late Night Talk Shows have a tradition of the "opening monologue" that is often a mix of jokes AND serious commentary about the day's events. Hosts go on after a tragedy, like say 9/11 or a school shooting, and give a serious statement about the day. People appreciate that.

But... Kimmel, in his monologue, said things that were just not true and he said them in a way that implied he knew them as truth and not as his opinion. He gave commentary about the shooter and claimed the shooter was definitely someone on the right and then made comments beyond that extrapolating from that assertion. The thing is, that was not a known fact at the time. It was rumor and speculation. Far too many news outlets were guilty of speculation and desperately wanting the shooter to be "the enemy" so they could ride a high horse... but facts were not known... and once the shooter was caught, a very different picture than statements like Kimmel made were found to be truth.

Retractions and apologies never make as big of a splash as the initial incorrect statements. I think Kimmel was irresponsible for saying what he said at the time he said it. IF he were a news anchor then I would 100% be in favor of his firing over that kind of statement. There are other anchors in other places I would say the same about, but this is not the post for that. I will note that MSNBC did apparently fire one anchor for comments made on the day of Kirk's shooting... so there's that at least.

But with Kimmel being a talk show host... I think that gives him some leeway to be stupid and ignorant and say shit he shouldn't have said. Which is why this gets dangerous. This wasn't a case of Disney or ABC suspending him because they didn't like his monologue. This smells more like a case of NexTel, who owns a lot of ABC affiliates and who is in talks for a big merger to become the largest owner of local stations in the country... NexTel threatened to pull Kimmel's show off their ABC affiliates unless Disney/ABC did something... because NexTel doesn't want the FCC to be against their upcoming merger... and Disney/ABC already had a settlement giving money to Trump over a previous thing so they don't want a part in anything potentially dodgy so they capitulated. And it doesn't help that after the Colbert/Paramount thing when Trump cheered that and said "Kimmel is next" and here we are with Kimmel next...

Everything is so fucking intertwined and the fuckery is all over so it is hard to keep track of all the nuance going on right now... but it's hard to find a lot of "good guys" when you look around the landscape... and it honestly seems like a lot of people kind of want to see the world burn right now, on all sides.

You are obsessed with trying to paint both sides are equal despite one rapidly ticking off increasing amounts of boxes on text book fascism and the other is not sad about someone who explicitly wanted fascism at the expense of other people, their lives even. You are even equating, people criticising and choosing to not support a show vs the government pressuring private companies to remove somone for somthing. You are not "balanced" nor "nuanced" and pretedning to be is just at the expense of everyone else in America who is actually suffering, which is somehow less important than one social media influencer who incited political violence and encouraged hate and discouraged empathy being shot. I am tired of living in a world pretending people like you are good people or reasonable because you can blatently twist any situation to cry "both sides" or cry how you want people to settle problems without violence of which your both side bs is partially repsonsible for why trans people like me live in this world and face violenc. You have literal facists by the very definition of the word, you have the law, consitutuion and people blatently not giving a shit and allowing this to happen despite being clear as day, and yet all you can do is cry how both sides are the same by blaterntly twisting information so you can sit on a high horse? If the best humanity can offer is you and the rest of the species I am better off ending my life than clinging to hope that just maybe, just maybe there might be justice. If there is a god I hope he can help this world becasue I don't know who the fuck else will.

 

[JealousOfTheElderly]

I swear people are getting more and more retarded with their conspiracy theories. Guy was extremely pro-Israel and said "Palestine doesn't exist". 0 evidence of Israel having anything to do with his assassination (shooter isn't even Jewish). If Israel wanted to go after someone it would obviously be Zohran Mamdani, who said Netanyahu would be arrested in New York City.

Netanyahu 100% deserves to be arrested in NYC. I am sorry you have to live under his rule. I do not have anything against Jewish people or Israelis but I think that the Israeli government is disgusting and I hate how the US government is "in bed" with them.

 

[Dejected 55]

You are obsessed with trying to paint both sides are equal despite one rapidly ticking off increasing amounts of boxes on text book fascism and the other is not sad about someone who explicitly wanted fascism at the expense of other people, their lives even. You are even equating, people criticising and choosing to not support a show vs the government pressuring private companies to remove somone for somthing. You are not "balanced" nor "nuanced" and pretedning to be is just at the expense of everyone else in America who is actually suffering, which is somehow less important than one social media influencer who incited political violence and encouraged hate and discouraged empathy being shot. I am tired of living in a world pretending people like you are good people or reasonable because you can blatently twist any situation to cry "both sides" or cry how you want people to settle problems without violence of which your both side bs is partially repsonsible for why trans people like me live in this world and face violenc. You have literal facists by the very definition of the word, you have the law, consitutuion and people blatently not giving a shit and allowing this to happen despite being clear as day, and yet all you can do is cry how both sides are the same by blaterntly twisting information so you can sit on a high horse? If the best humanity can offer is you and the rest of the species I am better off ending my life than clinging to hope that just maybe, just maybe there might be justice. If there is a god I hope he can help this world becasue I don't know who the fuck else will.

When have I ever said both sides are equal?

You're not reading my posts. I can't make you read them. I can't make anyone read them. I also can't make you understand them either. If you can't see how this thing is continuing to escalate as I said it probably would... then you're not paying attention. There's a difference in liking reality and recognizing it. The world sucks. I don't want to be a part of it either. But people trying to cancel everyone and kill each other isn't helping. And you are getting madder at someone losing their job for something they said than you are someone losing their life for something they said. That was the point I was making. You are acting like a dude getting fired for something he said is worse than someone dying for something he said. That makes no sense to me whether you agree with anything else.

And I did point out that Kimmel wasn't suspended because he said something his employer didn't like. I said it was almost certainly because of FCC pressure, and that's a horse of a different color since it is a 1st Amendment issue... That shows me you didn't read the whole post. Just tuned out when you didn't like something early on.

You think the party you support in government cares any more about you than Trump cares about his voters? Don't fool yourself. Most people in both elected parties care only about themselves and their friends. If you get anything out of it, that's an unintended consequence. Is one party worse? Sure. From my perspective right now the Republicans are considerably worse than Democrats. I'm pretty sure I've said that countless times. I never said they were "equally bad" or anything of the sort. I just say over and over that, if anyone thinks voting in their "side" will fix everything, they are delusional because both sides have pretty much the same goal to get theirs and screw over everyone else in the process.

 

[Pessimist]

Netanyahu 100% deserves to be arrested in NYC. I am sorry you have to live under his rule. I do not have anything against Jewish people or Israelis but I think that the Israeli government is disgusting and I hate how the US government is "in bed" with them.

Yeah but it has nothing to do with Kirk.

 

[Skallagrim]

The situation around Kimmel, and indeed Colbert, has nothing to do with ratings, nothing to do with Charlie Kirk, and everything to do with a President who has a massive ego, the emotional restraint of a toddler, and is perfectly happy to use the machinery of the state to push his will.

It's not left, it's not right, it's just what the situation is.

Now the word "fascism" is flying around. Yes, this action is fascist, but does that mean fascism is about to arrive? Well... it depends...

There ARE fascists in the US administration. Miller is one, and there are others. Vance, who I really thought would have pushed back on this, is exposing himself as unprincipled, ambitious, and perfectly willing to get into the dirt with these people. But, and this might be a bitter pill for people on the left to swallow; Trump is not a fascist. The man is just a complete narcissist without any sense of restraint and who can't handle being told that he isn't the smartest man in the universe. He's got no real political agenda AT ALL, he just wants adulation, respect, and for people to think of him as some sort of heroic saviour - that's it. He has not one single firm belief beyond his own aggrandizement and cult of personality.

The question that needs to be asked is this - will he allow the real fascists surrounding him to change the system to suit their agenda?

 

[ConfettiSpaghetti]

When have I ever said both sides are equal?

You're not reading my posts. I can't make you read them. I can't make anyone read them. I also can't make you understand them either. If you can't see how this thing is continuing to escalate as I said it probably would... then you're not paying attention. There's a difference in liking reality and recognizing it. The world sucks. I don't want to be a part of it either. But people trying to cancel everyone and kill each other isn't helping. And you are getting madder at someone losing their job for something they said than you are someone losing their life for something they said. That was the point I was making. You are acting like a dude getting fired for something he said is worse than someone dying for something he said. That makes no sense to me whether you agree with anything else.

And I did point out that Kimmel wasn't suspended because he said something his employer didn't like. I said it was almost certainly because of FCC pressure, and that's a horse of a different color since it is a 1st Amendment issue... That shows me you didn't read the whole post. Just tuned out when you didn't like something early on.

You think the party you support in government cares any more about you than Trump cares about his voters? Don't fool yourself. Most people in both elected parties care only about themselves and their friends. If you get anything out of it, that's an unintended consequence. Is one party worse? Sure. From my perspective right now the Republicans are considerably worse than Democrats. I'm pretty sure I've said that countless times. I never said they were "equally bad" or anything of the sort. I just say over and over that, if anyone thinks voting in their "side" will fix everything, they are delusional because both sides have pretty much the same goal to get theirs and screw over everyone else in the process.

one side is latterly rounding people up off the street... i hope if one day things get better you are still around, and i hope you remember that all the people who suffered and died, you are partially responsible and no amount of "oops" or "it was a different time" will change that. You keep deluding yourself into both siding this. And then when everyone else suffers the consequences you just keep spouting your both sides shit and blatantly defending fascism. I mean clearly you care more about being respectful about social media influences who advocate for stripping peoples rights away and advocate for political violence than the people who are loosing their rights, who are being killed, rounded of the street with no due process. But go off. People like you are why I am on this site and suicidal in the first place. But since you will likely not be impacted by your stupidity, at least not yet, you will just list excuses after excuse.

 

[Dejected 55]

one side is latterly rounding people up off the street... i hope if one day things get better you are still around, and i hope you remember that all the people who suffered and died, you are partially responsible and no amount of "oops" or "it was a different time" will change that. You keep deluding yourself into both siding this. And then when everyone else suffers the consequences you just keep spouting your both sides shit and blatantly defending fascism. I mean clearly you care more about being respectful about social media influences who advocate for stripping peoples rights away and advocate for political violence than the people who are loosing their rights, who are being killed, rounded of the street with no due process. But go off. People like you are why I am on this site and suicidal in the first place. But since you will likely not be impacted by your stupidity, at least not yet, you will just list excuses after excuse.

You are the one wishing for violence and death to anyone who says something different than you. You are part of the problem of the escalating violence. Did you start it? Probably not. Again, you keep declaring I am saying all things are equal. I've literally never said or felt that. You twist words to see what you want to see, and in that you share more in common with your "enemy" than you would like to admit.

This world is doomed if everyone just wants to demonize anyone different, and respond to hate with hate, respond to violence with more violence. As they say, an eye for an eye ends up with everyone blind eventually.

Also, you're the one celebrating suffering and death of others... much in the same way you say your enemy celebrates your suffering. Why be surprised when people you dislike cheer your misfortune when you cheer theirs?

I care that the souls of supposedly good people get lost every day because they succumb to the same temptations of violence as the bad people. If the Kirks of the world say bad things, I know who he is and can guard myself. If his opponents, ideally the people who I could turn to for support, cheer his death and think nothing of it... then there are no good guys left. One side wants to demonize and hate and stir up trouble. But now both sides are increasingly expressing themselves with violence.

And you say I'm "partially responsible." I'll ask again... What are YOU doing to put a stop to all the hate and death and suffering in the world? You're just ranting about how great it is when someone you dislike dies and getting angry at anyone who calls you out on it. You've expended far more energy here in this thread trying to defend your love of violence than I've seen you expend trying to help any cause you would say you believe in... I hope you will remember that, when the civil war breaks out and people on both sides are dying in the streets. You will be responsible for that.

 

[EternalShore]

Hi~ :) I'd like to apologize for my prior remarks~ I didn't know much about him and was merely using this as a venting thread about my parents' commentators (not that my brother's aren't worse)~
After his death, I read quite a fair bit about him and watched videos about him and addressing his death as well~ It turns out that I never told my parents to turn him off, contrary to other commentators who I did do so for~
I get that life isn't very well valued here, but well, what if one finally recovers from their ideation and wants to live before being shot by someone who merely disagreed with them politically~? I agree with many of the things he said and disagree with many others (like on trans issues), however, shooting someone for that is wrong~ Moreover, he didn't hide in his own echo chamber like many right wingers are prone to doing but engaged in dialogue with those from the other side, probably refining his own view points as he went along~ I do hope that God will find him good in His sight~ :)
I can't help but feel really sad for his wife, who lost her husband and may have to live alone for the rest of her life~ :( Sure, she has kids to keep her company thankfully, but being a single mom is a very big hassle as well! and his kids who will hardly or never know their father~ :( That is something truly tragic~ :(

Adding onto this, I'd probably say yes for that very reason~ xD but like a militia (like the WW2 resistance movements) rather than the army (I'm not even allowed to enlist anyways~) or anything! So this is probably true~

This regards the funeral and venting about commentators as I did on the Sanctuary once~ This is still my statement regarding Charlie Kirk~ For my opinion on him, read this~ I'm posting this here rather than posting a new thread because I expect it'll be buried if it's unpopular xD

As I expected, my parents are still mourning him, altho they never talked to him almost 2 weeks later~ They're now watching the funeral~ It's just that I'm frustrated at how these guys seem to think life is so easy~ as if they've been blessed and never struggled~ like ah, I did this! So you obviously can and should too! But life is more difficult than that~ :/ I'd looooove to get married and have kids rn and raise a family and be a good mother instead of working~ >_< but like, the first one isn't happening anytime soon (altho, it's along the way now! :D)~ And I really want kids and to be a stay-at-home mom, but that's just not possible rn~ :((( so stop yelling at me about things I can't do~ >_< People have it harder than you, you know~ and well, when your whole life sucks, being told to just "make it better" doesn't actually do anything, you know~ It just makes you irritated at the people telling you that and even depressed, hopeless, and sewer slidal too~ :/
and the fact that you have the gall to basically yell at me and say that "hey, you should do that" when I clearly can't do that is just so ugh~ >_<
It's also weird how this feels very much like a Christian-religious rally~ I don't necessarily oppose that given what he was but yeah, it's odd to talk about more than Jesus at a Christian funeral~
also, his wife not speaking last but Trump doing so is really weird~ >_<

 

[YandereMikuMistress]

I am not saying that. I am saying that it is ironic that a man who spend a good chunk of his life being pro gun violence got killed by a person doing a gun violence. You are taking my words out of context. I never said anything about gun ownership or the second ammendment because frankly, I have no leg in that race either way

Plus it's really funny to say "it's not okay to use tragedies as an excuse for trying to take other ppls rights away" like buddy.... remember 9/11? Or is it just infringing on other peoples rights good actually if they are brown and/or pray on in the direction of Mecca?

Thank you !

 

[woofwag]

I'm just gonna ignore anyone who wants to argue with me so save your breath.

The dude got what he deserved. Argued to not have stronger gun laws and said it was okay if some people had to get shot. What a fucking tool, hope his kids grow up to recognize that he argued for his own demise.

Saying this one more time for the people in the back: HE ARGUED IN SUPPORT OF PEOPLE GETTING KILLED. WHEN ASKED HE SAID IT WAS OKAY IF PEOPLE GOT MURDERED!

Hard agree. People can yap yap yap whatever they want to me. His last words were him trying to pull a gotcha on someone talking about gun violence. I truly don't care if someone who promotes Jim Crow era laws, anti-abortion legislation, anti-trans legislation, neo fascism ideology, etc, dies. People die every day! Why should I care about some random political asshole kicking it? Call me a heartless monster, whatever the fuck you want, idc. I've had my rights (and the rights of other minorities) continually argued by him and people like him to be eliminated. I don't feel an ounce of sympathy for the guy. Good riddance.

 

[vitbar]

People have always celebrated the death of bad people, and it was wrong to murder him. Killing over words is bad, and he deserves the celebration of people he made enemies with his words. Death doesn't erase deeds.

 

[Hvergelmir]

Death doesn't erase deeds.

Pardon my ignorance, but what did the guy do? Specifically; not like some vague contribution to some speculative future death camp?

 

[vitbar]

Pardon my ignorance, but what did the guy do? Specifically; not like some vague contribution to some speculative future death camp?

He is racist imo, though he denies it. He went from demanding the Epstein files be released to playing defence for the Trump administration's refusal. Defending pedophiles for political reasons (this upset even a section of his fans). He constantly demonstrated a high level of partisanship like the Epstein example above. Playing defence for actions by his favoured party while labeling similar actions by the democrats as terrible. Not that this is unusual in politics, but that isn't an excuse. If you are going to be highly partisan like this then you will gain a crowd of people who will be glad to see you go.

If you want more concrete examples I can provide. It might take some time as I didn't keep notes. It's all things I heard him say or saw him tweet over the years.

 

[Hvergelmir]

If you want more concrete examples I can provide.

You're not obligated to compile anything for me, of course. But if you or anyone else have something particularly bad, I'd be curious to see it.

 

[noname223]

Charlie Kirk spread the right-wing extreme trope of the great replacement theory. Agitating against minorities and demonizing and dehumanizing foreigners and migrants.

,

Charlie Kirk Wants to Start a Border Militia to Protect ‘White Demographics in America’

On his radio show Thursday, Charlie Kirk advocated for the creation of a "citizen force" to be sent to the U.S.-Mexico border to protect against the "invasion" of the country by Haitian refugees and prevent the "diminishing and decreasing [of] white demographics in America." Kirk played a clip...

www.mediaite.com

He spread Trump's lies about the outcome of the 2020 election undermining the US democracy. He fueled January 6th with more than 80 busses full of protesters that contributed to storming the Captiol which led to the deaths of innocent police Men.

Charlie Kirk on Twitter

“This historic event will likely be one of the largest and most consequential in American history The team at @TrumpStudents & Turning Point Action are honored to help make this happen, sending 80+ buses full of patriots to DC to fight for this president https://t.co/0fjBTUcrBI”

web.archive.org

He spread the right-wing extreme trope of cultural marxism.
And in this clip is He spreading Antisemitic conspiracy theories. Which is basically the trope of cultural marxism.

Charlie Kirk: https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/charlie-kirk-jewish-money-quote/
There are clips of these quotes in the linked article.

Jewish donors have been the No. 1 funding mechanism of radical open-border, neoliberal, quasi-Marxist policies, cultural institutions and nonprofits. This is a beast created by secular Jews and now they're coming for Jews, and they're like, "What on Earth happened?"
And it's not just the colleges. It's the nonprofits, it's the movies, it's Hollywood, it's all of it.

Jews have been some of the largest funders of cultural Marxist ideas and supporters of those ideas over the last 30 or 40 years.
[…]
Until you cleanse that ideology from the hierarchy in the academic elite of the West, there will not be a safe future. I'm not going to say Israel won't exist, but Israel will be in jeopardy as long as the Western children, children of the West, are being taught, with primarily Jewish dollars, subsidizing it, to view everything through oppressor oppressed dynamic. Until you shed that ideology, you will not be able to build the case for Israel, because they view Israel as an oppressor.

I want to emphasize despite All of that I am against his murder. And it does not justify this action. Political violence is not the solution. It was wrong to kill him. But you wanted some evidence of something particular bad.

In Germany his takes would be considered anti-constitutional, spreading of hatred against minorities and anti-democratic.

 

[sinfonia]

Cultural marxism is not an extremist trope.

 

[noname223]

Cultural marxism is not an extremist trope.

Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Here used by the Heritage Fundation (Project2025)

How Cultural Marxism Threatens the United States—and How Americans Can Fight It

www.heritage.org

Here an essay about the usage of this term by right-wing extreme figures Like the terrorist Anders Breivik. Also a fan of great replacement theory. Just like Kirk.

Cultural Marxism and the Radical Right

This essay examines the conspiratorial dynamics of the term Cultural Marxism, which has been deployed by a number of extreme right activists. Jamin parses this discourse from its origins in the Free Congress Foundation, to its uptake by the high-profile American...

link.springer.com

 

[sinfonia]

Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Here used by the Heritage Fundation (Project2025)

How Cultural Marxism Threatens the United States—and How Americans Can Fight It

www.heritage.org

Here an essay about the usage of this term by right-wing extreme figures Like the terrorist Anders Breivik. Also a fan of great replacement theory. Just like Kirk.

Cultural Marxism and the Radical Right

This essay examines the conspiratorial dynamics of the term Cultural Marxism, which has been deployed by a number of extreme right activists. Jamin parses this discourse from its origins in the Free Congress Foundation, to its uptake by the high-profile American...

link.springer.com

Ok, but isnt the term descriptive of a real phenomenon that's been taking place in a greatly accelerated form since at least the 1920s? I dont see why anyone should be labeled an extremist for using it.

There might be some conspiratorial elements in it but conspiracy is often how normal people make sense of complex political and cultural processes; this does not mean the entire thing is made up to stir hatred.

My point is we should focus on the actual meaning of the term and not the people who use it for rhetorical purposes.

 

[R. A.]

Pardon my ignorance, but what did the guy do? Specifically; not like some vague contribution to some speculative future death camp?

Do you think the current and past heads of Exxon Mobil are innocent cause they're not the ones operating the drills?
Do you think Trump is innocent because he's not the one physically putting people into ICE camps and flying the planes with them aboard off to wherever?
Do you think Hitler was innocent because he didn't personally murder millions of people?

 

[Hvergelmir]

But you wanted some evidence of something particular bad.

Thank you. That's good data, and I have to agree that he's crossing the line from political opinion, to inflammatory rhetoric.

Do you think the current and past heads of Exxon Mobil are innocent cause they're not the ones operating the drills?
Do you think Trump is innocent because he's not the one physically putting people into ICE camps and flying the planes with them aboard off to wherever?
Do you think Hitler was innocent because he didn't personally murder millions of people?

I agree that decision makers are accountable for their decisions, if that's what you're asking.
I don't think your examples are equatable to each other, or Kirk.

 

[R. A.]

Thank you. That's good data, and I have to agree that he's crossing the line from political opinion, to inflammatory rhetoric.

I agree that decision makers are accountable for their decisions, if that's what you're asking.
I don't think your examples are equatable to each other, or Kirk.

I will have to assume you did not see the very lengthy explanation of his bullshit I laboriously laid out several pages ago. He was also seen as instrumental in Trump getting reelected. That's fucking culpability. No, I'm not feeding you sources; look it up yourself. If you simply choose not to...

 

[Hvergelmir]

look it up yourself

Believe me, I tried. The debates I found were civil, and justified.
I'm not in the U.S. right-wing circles of X, and I cannot take lists of allegations seriously. Over-exaggerations and intentional misunderstandings are way too common.

I think that the true reason for for Trump's success is that the political climate have devolved to a point where people can't exchange information. The political camps are literally using different languages. It's quite Orwellian.

War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.