Future psych nurse here, what do you want to tell me about suicidality?

[lucyna]

Hi all, hope you're doing well all things considered.

I used to be quite active here during my darkest moments and decided to study to be a psychiatric nurse, since personally I got a lot of help from them.
However, depending where you live, healthcare workers including nurses and doctors can be assholes and just simply suck. Believe me, I know and I definitely want to do my part on breaking that cycle. This is just for my personal professional growth so I help people in the same situation i used to be in as well as I can. Our situations as patients differ a lot so your input is really, really important to me.

You can write anything you like, you can vent about bad experiences and just give couple tips, here's also some questions to help you:
Do you have good or bad experiences in healthcare services?
What made them good or bad?
Where do nurses fail and what could they do better?
Can you describe your optimal, "dream" nurse? What makes them good in your eyes? Where do they differ from bad nurses?

Thank you in advance and keep going

 

[Rabbit&Blackberry]

an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure

 

[WishfulNeanderthal]

I have had contact with psychiatry (we call it BUP in Sweden) for all my teenage years, later, after I turned 18, I was thrown out into the wild, I recently have had some successful contact with adult psychiatry (I'm now 25). My memory of my teenage years is blurry to say, since depression's inflammatory effect on the brain. I have autism, which plays a factor in how I mask depression and/or anxiety, so what I will say is this:

First off, its commendable that you are aiming for that kind of a job, I have a degree in psychology myself (but didnt go the therapist route due to the mental strain i have heard it causes) and it shows that you care about people, so thank you for that.

I'll base my answers on the aforementioned aspects:

1. Regarding good and bad experiences, I've had several good experiences with therapists where they adapted to the information I gave to them, they were non-judgmental, and I really feel that they listened. I also feel that their mental walls were down a bit (since healthcare workers go through a lot of painful experiences/patients telling them painful experiences, I have heard they create a kind of mental wall), which made it easier for me to connect with them.

When it comes to bad experiences, I'll two examples, one is where a doctor was hearing my struggles and told me "taking a walk and training will solve that" (spoiler: it did not, thankfully he was fired), so realizing that yes a healthy lifestyle can increase the chances of wellbeing, it isnt neccesarily causative. The other example was recently an experience of talking with a doctor, and as they read through my journal they decided to put me on the same medication that i was on before (and had no effect), so the important point to take from there is that before prescribing medication, if it hasnt been shown to work before, if there are legitimate causes behind that choice its good to be super clear on why its being done.

2. A good nurse (in my case, at least) is someone who realizes that some autistic people really do mask their depression to the point of it being difficult to diagnose when having meetings with them. The same goes for suicidality. A good nurse is also someone who not only cares for the patient, but for themselves as well. Nothing good can come from an individual being overloaded by a hectic schedule mixed in with people being in psychological or physical pain, so self-care is key to being a good nurse.

And lastly, it is important to keep oneself informed and open to alternatives when it comes to therapy and medication. Some medications can obviously make someone more suicidal, while some therapy methods just simply don't work on some individuals. But of course it's worth a try, while also being open to switching to another method if one isn't working.

I hope your studies go really well, as a fellow student (well soon to be ex student) remember to take breaks, aint no use getting straight A's if the mental health isn't well. And thank you :D

 

[lucyna]

an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure

I totally agree, thank you for replying!

I have had contact with psychiatry (we call it BUP in Sweden) for all my teenage years, later, after I turned 18, I was thrown out into the wild, I recently have had some successful contact with adult psychiatry (I'm now 25). My memory of my teenage years is blurry to say, since depression's inflammatory effect on the brain. I have autism, which plays a factor in how I mask depression and/or anxiety, so what I will say is this:

First off, its commendable that you are aiming for that kind of a job, I have a degree in psychology myself (but didnt go the therapist route due to the mental strain i have heard it causes) and it shows that you care about people, so thank you for that.

I'll base my answers on the aforementioned aspects:

1. Regarding good and bad experiences, I've had several good experiences with therapists where they adapted to the information I gave to them, they were non-judgmental, and I really feel that they listened. I also feel that their mental walls were down a bit (since healthcare workers go through a lot of painful experiences/patients telling them painful experiences, I have heard they create a kind of mental wall), which made it easier for me to connect with them.

When it comes to bad experiences, I'll two examples, one is where a doctor was hearing my struggles and told me "taking a walk and training will solve that" (spoiler: it did not, thankfully he was fired), so realizing that yes a healthy lifestyle can increase the chances of wellbeing, it isnt neccesarily causative. The other example was recently an experience of talking with a doctor, and as they read through my journal they decided to put me on the same medication that i was on before (and had no effect), so the important point to take from there is that before prescribing medication, if it hasnt been shown to work before, if there are legitimate causes behind that choice its good to be super clear on why its being done.

2. A good nurse (in my case, at least) is someone who realizes that some autistic people really do mask their depression to the point of it being difficult to diagnose when having meetings with them. The same goes for suicidality. A good nurse is also someone who not only cares for the patient, but for themselves as well. Nothing good can come from an individual being overloaded by a hectic schedule mixed in with people being in psychological or physical pain, so self-care is key to being a good nurse.

And lastly, it is important to keep oneself informed and open to alternatives when it comes to therapy and medication. Some medications can obviously make someone more suicidal, while some therapy methods just simply don't work on some individuals. But of course it's worth a try, while also being open to switching to another method if one isn't working.

I hope your studies go really well, as a fellow student (well soon to be ex student) remember to take breaks, aint no use getting straight A's if the mental health isn't well. And thank you :D

Excellent points, thank you so much. It's very cool that you have a psychology degree, I used to want to study it! I can definitely see myself building a "mental wall" further down the road which definitely doesn't help in scenarios of patients mental wellbeing. The nurses I had which ended up saving my life definitely had their walls down with me and that's a point I didn't realize until now, as usual the doctor was an asshole but I demanded further help so I got it lol. Masking is also such a great point, we have little education on neurodiverse people (I have ADHD myself) so your reply is worth more than gold to me. I think self-care is an excellent point too and I definitely agree. You're well spoken and intelligent, the degree definitely wasn't for nothing! I'm sure you can use it for good.
Thank you so, so much for replying, I wish you the best in the future!

 

[sleepy_redcar]

Hi all, hope you're doing well all things considered.

I used to be quite active here during my darkest moments and decided to study to be a psychiatric nurse, since personally I got a lot of help from them.
However, depending where you live, healthcare workers including nurses and doctors can be assholes and just simply suck. Believe me, I know and I definitely want to do my part on breaking that cycle. This is just for my personal professional growth so I help people in the same situation i used to be in as well as I can. Our situations as patients differ a lot so your input is really, really important to me.

You can write anything you like, you can vent about bad experiences and just give couple tips, here's also some questions to help you:
Do you have good or bad experiences in healthcare services?
What made them good or bad?
Where do nurses fail and what could they do better?
Can you describe your optimal, "dream" nurse? What makes them good in your eyes? Where do they differ from bad nurses?

Thank you in advance and keep going

This is kind of unrelated but myself as a student thinking of switching to psych nurse route (i've never been treated due to fear of being diagnosed) this post and the replies really helped me understand more from the experience of being a patient, I wish you the best luck in your studies, and hope you become someone's helper in their darkest time

 

[WishfulNeanderthal]

I totally agree, thank you for replying!


Excellent points, thank you so much. It's very cool that you have a psychology degree, I used to want to study it! I can definitely see myself building a "mental wall" further down the road which definitely doesn't help in scenarios of patients mental wellbeing. The nurses I had which ended up saving my life definitely had their walls down with me and that's a point I didn't realize until now, as usual the doctor was an asshole but I demanded further help so I got it lol. Masking is also such a great point, we have little education on neurodiverse people (I have ADHD myself) so your reply is worth more than gold to me. I think self-care is an excellent point too and I definitely agree. You're well spoken and intelligent, the degree definitely wasn't for nothing! I'm sure you can use it for good.
Thank you so, so much for replying, I wish you the best in the future!

Thank you so much for the kind words, I appreciate it alot! I am sure you will make a great nurse! I hope your day goes amazing and I wish you well <3

 

[always_sad]

-- A therapist didn't believe me because my history of child abuse was "too much" and at the end of the session he said "do you even want to be alive at this point". It was rude and unprofessional. Avoid making statements or assumptions, if you believe someone might be suicidal just ask them

Do you have good or bad experiences in healthcare services? -- Mostly bad. When I was at my worst I was treated like I'm a bother, crazy, unreliable. I didn't even do anything bad, I just locked myself in my room, became a dropout and stopped showering, sleeping and interacting with people. I would wear same clothes for weeks. My parents did absoultely nothing, they just kept blaming me for everything and told mental health professionals that I'm "driving them insane" and that I'm "problematic". No one asked me how I was doing, it was all about comfort of my family and not making them look bad. I was treated like a broken object that needs to be fixed so my parents can stop being bothered by my mere existence

Where do nurses fail and what could they do better? -- Rude comments, "that bitch is crazy, she's _ years old and she's still a shut in" was an insane thing to hear. Fuck nurses who are in this profession just because they want to have power over weaker people.

Can you describe your optimal, "dream" nurse? -- Just a normal person who doesn't make assumptions and rude comments, doesn't threaten people or sugarcoat issues, not pushy. I just want them to be normal...

 

[versuchskaninchen]

I know this sounds obvious but find a way to try to remember names..being referred to as the wrong name just felt like I was forgettable by my own nurses which did make me less likely to go to them.

Also, please try to see if you can help accommodate with hygiene things if the place you end up in lets you. I have curly hair and they just handed me barely a penny worth of conditioner and a comb my hair broke..made me feel unclean and awful and a nurse who helped me apply for a hairbrush and more conditioner being allowed let me at least not dread showers more than I did.

 

[milkteacrown]

I am very glad you're looking to become the change you want to see. I sincerely hope you can—I believe in you.

1) Do you have good or bad experiences?
Bad, largely. I experienced institutional abuse in my psychiatric hospital and I had to lie in order to get out and go home. However, one doctor, one supervisor, one tech, and two nurses were lovely people and I felt safe only around them.

2) What made them good or bad?
Most nurses didn't seem to care about me. They were pleasant towards me when I was in a good mood, but when I was breaking down, they would become incredibly cold—sometimes even being cruel towards me, like a nurse who laughed while I cried and told me I was being irrational. The psychiatrist in charge of deciding whether or not I could go home diagnosed me with borderline personality disorder and everything went downhill, because despite my pleasant and polite attitude, people had it in their heads that I was "crazy" in a way that wasn't worth respect. I also experienced abuse, which I experienced dissociative amnesia with, so I don't remember the details of that.

3) Where do nurses fail and what could they do better?
I think it's important for nurses to know that, when you're being held at a hospital against your will and placed at the mercy of strangers, it is extremely easy to lose trust. Small situations where you feel as though you were placed in danger may make you feel as though you are all alone and the people in charge are out to get you. This deeply worsens paranoia in, for example, patients with psychotic disorders.

4) What is your ideal nurse?
A nurse who sees me as a person, not a patient. A nurse who doesn't patronize me or overly exert control over me, who shows genuine compassion when I am struggling and has more than simple filler words and medication for me. Overall, a nurse I can trust with my wellbeing and feel safe with.

 

[whywere]

No matter what type of medical body or mind or both, a lot of the times when I have gone to a clinic or hospital and everything in between, when the person puts of white or other solid colors nowadays, they automatically seem to get a HUGE ego and attitude about themselves.

I have had so many run ins with doctors and nurses who come into the room where I am waiting and treat me as if I am so much less than they are and the worst part is that my thoughts about my ONW body and mind mean nothing to them, and it is never taken into account in regards to any form of treatments.

Just one time I would so love to have a doctor or nurse come in say: "Hi Walter, what brings you in or how are you today". NOPE it is shut up, sit still and do whatever we say without even breathing or it is DISRESPECT. If I counter them, so many times, it is GET OUT, REALLY?

If GOD gave a person, the ability to help others then help others and do not bring all the ego baggage with please.

I have been kicked out of so many mental health and medical clinics because I question something and BANG I am out.

If you are either a mental health nurse or going to be, PLEASE try and do not forget where you came from and also that folks are no less important.

We are ALL the same and we are ALL in this together.

Every day, one still learns new things every day from anyone and everyone and that is the power of being human.

Walter

 

[Holu]

Maybe a future clinical psychologist here(still studying lol 5 more years for my PhD yippee) and I'm sort of worried regarding the freedoms I'll be provided in regard to assisting my patients. So I'll ask a question to you that I've had to ask myself.

What do you plan on doing if someone expresses ideation, plan, intent to commit suicide. Let's say it's someone you had communications with, and you got the impression that while they feel this way, they are entirely autonomous and such thinking likely won't be deterred by a 3 day 5150 hold.

I've personally be hospitalized. It's not fun, I hated it, and from that point on I started just lying to everyone about my overall state. I'd feel awful doing the same to someone I could relate to but on the same note it would be a violation of the oath.

I'm curious what your thoughts on this are.

 

[Caffeineaddiction]

Try to understand. I don't know about you, but I'm here because I feel lost, alone, and rejected. I feel like there are some things that only I can see as a whole. Maybe that is true, or maybe I'm a crazy person. I don't know. But what I do know, is that empathy helps a lot. Try to put yourself in their shoes, and ask yourself "Okay, this person thinks this way. Is it good? Not neccessarily. Are they correct? Not neccessarily. But there is a reason for everything, and there is a reason for why they think this way." If you can find said reason and try to talk to them on equal grounds it might help. I don't know, if you already know what I have told you, maybe this comment is entierly useless, in which case I'm sorry. But I can't really offer anything more than this. I have been struggling with suicidal thoughts ever since I was a small child. If I had solved my problems, I wouldn't be on this site, but obviously I'm doing something wrong, because I still feel like garbage.

 

[GeminiButter]

Thanks for posting this and sharing with us. I'm glad to see that you relied on this site in past low moments, and are now at a place where you're able to think of the future enough to make plans like this. I really wish you well and hope that you're able to make a difference.

In my experience, I've had some of my best and worst interactions in the mental health system with nurses. The worst ones were not until I was in an impatient ward a few months ago, till that point I generally always had a much better opinion of nurses than I did doctors I still think about the nurse I saw as a therapist for a few years when I was in the children's services (I'm not in my 30s) which is a testament to a good a relationship I had with the person at the time.

When I think about the nurses I like and I've had good experiences with, it comes down to a few things: they respected me as a person and showed me respect in ways that is unfortunately in frequent in the mental health system; they recognised that I had a unique and crucially important Knowledge about myself and my health and that was respected as important, even though it's obviously different to medical experience or a degree in nursing or medicine; they were honest and direct with me, which did of course include telling me things I didn't want to hear or accept or didn't like, but they didn't pretend that something wasn't the case and they explained the context of a decision to me fully, in ways that I understood, and respected me enough to be honest with me. They also acknowledged the limits of their understanding or knowledge, whether it was talking about pronouns and gender or the lack of training that nurses had in general around autism and neurodivergence.

and really importantly, they acknowledged when they got something wrong or made a mistake or didn't do something that they said they would And apologised for it. In my experience in the UK, there is a really really big lack of medical professionals wanting to admit they did something wrong or made a mistake, and I know some of this comes from legal liabilities and things like that, but when I think about all of the harm that has been done to me by medical Professionals and services, I never want to actually make formal complaints or try and get money out of them, when someone apologises and I can tell it is sincere, that's always the end goal for me. So that has made a big difference as well.

I'm going to share a link to a book that I came across awhile ago when I was also thinking about nursing, I've only read the introduction and it was very powerful (it was available as a free sample on Kindle), but if you're studying you might be able to get it from your library. I took a lot from it and you might too. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Critical-Mental-Health-Nursing-Observations/dp/1910919403

Best of luck

 

[ElTopo]

I think most people in the healthcare, and mainly mental health sector eventually need to turn apathetic in order to survive, dealing with a part of everyone's deep shit takes a big toll on anyone and eventually their supposed empathy becomes mechanical and logical.
Furthermore I think it's scandalous how pricy mental care is, I live in a european country where basic healthcare is free but for some reason therapy of mental healthcare isn't and is crazy expensive.

I don't think you should see suicidality as one big phenomenon but rather a place people resort to, it's the reason they resort to that place that should determine how you treat them, some people are justified in looking for an exit I think, some others are just confused and scared and should be helped.
Wish you luck on your carreer, you should keep us updated, it's rare being able to talk to a professional

 

[Unbearable Mr. Bear]

Just treat your patients as human beings and thing will be alright. Some people are just really starved for human contact, and receiving genuine compassion in person can change things for the better. Here at SaSu we do the best we can via words and sometimes images, but one thing I would like to do in person is sitting with those suffering and letting them express themselves, and trying to be comforting as possible. You don't need to carry my will, but I hope you do your best to be that someone they need, even if for only a little while. It makes a ton of difference

Other than that, just study well and try to be a good person!

 

[CrownRoyal]

Hi all, hope you're doing well all things considered.

I used to be quite active here during my darkest moments and decided to study to be a psychiatric nurse, since personally I got a lot of help from them.
However, depending where you live, healthcare workers including nurses and doctors can be assholes and just simply suck. Believe me, I know and I definitely want to do my part on breaking that cycle. This is just for my personal professional growth so I help people in the same situation i used to be in as well as I can. Our situations as patients differ a lot so your input is really, really important to me.

You can write anything you like, you can vent about bad experiences and just give couple tips, here's also some questions to help you:
Do you have good or bad experiences in healthcare services?
What made them good or bad?
Where do nurses fail and what could they do better?
Can you describe your optimal, "dream" nurse? What makes them good in your eyes? Where do they differ from bad nurses?

Thank you in advance and keep going

I personally felt that, in healthcare, mental status assessments often follow a checklist of questions that sound robotic, as if the provider is simply checking items off a list. I didn't feel like I was being treated as a human being. It's more like: "Substance use?" "Are you working right now?" "How is your mood on a scale from one to ten?" Genuine compassion seems hard to come by, and it can be challenging to feel truly heard.

 

[SchizoGymnast]

Honestly I wasn't sure if I should trust you or not. People who openly advertise that they are in the mental health system are suspect for obvious reasons. But if you really want to know, I have a couple things for you to consider.

This might be radical, but you don't have to be symptom-free in order to be well. You don't have to be happy and productive in order to be well. I believe you can be lazy, angry, suicidal, messy, etc...and still be well. Being well isn't about looking good to whatever society you happen to live in, or being useful to others. It's about knowing when to sail and when to dock, to rest but not quit, and being able to find meaning in the goings on of your life.

This is another radical idea. Help people plan their suicides. Encourage them to write their obituaries. I understand that this goes against everything you will ever be taught, that we want to distract, that we don't want to enable people to be dangers to themselves. But I think having these conversations can destigmatize suicide. It diminishes the shock value and minimizes the risk of people using suicide as a cry for help. It opens up conversations about the possible risk of suffering and survival. It opens up conversations about what really matters to us, and in the end, we are reminded that we are the authors of our stories. If we can write our deaths, we can rewrite our lives.

 

[IDontKnowEverything]

My darkest times are gone yet with my infinitely self destructive nature, I have and only will continue to put myself through hell, despite the brief intervals of joy life in theory can get me. If I'm still alive in a few years, if you ask me now that's most probably horrible news, but for the chance of my answer being different later, help is needed.
For my country medicine is effed because all of our medical students move straight out because of how bad the connditions are for being a doctor here, physical or mental, and we are mostly left with people who do all but listen. You'll get some pills at most if you are lucky.
Bit difficult to enter a room with a person with decades of lost hope and still smile when they judge and fully misinterpret all you say.
There is much you can learn at the beggining, but my two cents are that to suceed you'll need to know how to keep all you've learnt along the way and actually still see people as human beings. Not liabilities, not threaths, not "brainless unexperienced" kids nor as idiots.
Our mental help professionals have all been pissed off one too many times and don't even try to actually look and see anymore.
Keep yourself professional yet actually listen to all your patient is saying is my advice.

 

[Manic Panic]

I feel like a portion of psych nurses are only in for the money and not actually helping people.

If people really wanted to die they'd do it , they go to get help because they believe they can get it but having a bad experience can definitely push people over the edge .

 

[IDontKnowEverything]

If we can write our deaths, we can rewrite our lives.

I remember this being my philosophy for a while yet I fully forgot it. You just worded a lost memory of mine.
In the end as great as the idea is, I cannot predict how often this will put people in harm's way instead of reduce the harm, plus the "do no harm" oath would likely stop professionals from doing that on the clock.. but in theory I am imagining a world where you are just accepted despite your want for death. Where, are you said, it isn't a cry for help because although removing that factor isn't fully possible, some simply getting the help they needed would have made a lot of difference. (Sorry if my writing is semi-incoherent.)

they go to get help because they believe they can get it

painful but true

 

[SchizoGymnast]

I remember this being my philosophy for a while yet I fully forgot it. You just worded a lost memory of mine.
In the end as great as the idea is, I cannot predict how often this will put people in harm's way instead of reduce the harm, plus the "do no harm" oath would likely stop professionals from doing that on the clock.. but in theory I am imagining a world where you are just accepted despite your want for death. Where, are you said, it isn't a cry for help because although removing that factor isn't fully possible, some simply getting the help they needed would have made a lot of difference. (Sorry if my writing is semi-incoherent.)

painful but true

I think there are ways in which this can be done safely. To start, the helping professional would be as hands off as possible so there's no appearance of assisting suicide. And I and others had the experience of being asked to write our own obituary in college and it was a fun, reflective experience. Maybe in these sorts of situations where people are on the edge, a life review would be a more life-affirming alternative while still serving the same function.

 

[TheLastGreySky]

Hi all, hope you're doing well all things considered.

I used to be quite active here during my darkest moments and decided to study to be a psychiatric nurse, since personally I got a lot of help from them.
However, depending where you live, healthcare workers including nurses and doctors can be assholes and just simply suck. Believe me, I know and I definitely want to do my part on breaking that cycle. This is just for my personal professional growth so I help people in the same situation i used to be in as well as I can. Our situations as patients differ a lot so your input is really, really important to me.

You can write anything you like, you can vent about bad experiences and just give couple tips, here's also some questions to help you:
Do you have good or bad experiences in healthcare services?
What made them good or bad?
Where do nurses fail and what could they do better?
Can you describe your optimal, "dream" nurse? What makes them good in your eyes? Where do they differ from bad nurses?

Thank you in advance and keep going

I sincerely think that a lot of our suicidal idealizations come from escapism. I've been on this site a long time and I have leaned more on the suicidal side, not because life has been entirely dog shit awful as most people who are suicidal tend to paint it out to be, but because it's just endless cycles of underwhelming and overwhelming, and it feels like the more I know the more I feel unable to enjoy life because of episodes of disassociating and Anhedonia.

I think most people choose to label themselves and live inside a box of their own creation rather than take personal accountability and change their world. So many people who are suicidal refuse to acknowledge that there are countless other people who feel the same way yet find themselves unlovable or undeserving of love.
After a while depression feels like a safe place for the depressed. And although most of people's psychological issues that are environmental develop in childhood due to psychological and/or physical and sexual abuse, it's the inability to confront the preconceived notions we have of ourselves that only exacerbates our symptoms even to the point of developing psychosis.
I do not think the modern world is remotely interested in curing suicidal thoughts and behaviors, if so I think the push should be to accept that this is a condition that people legitimately NEED to be able to talk about WITHOUT being institutionalized. And I've seen so many therapists just become the "emotional support humans" of their patients while never pushing for personal accountability. No one likes that they're sick, but everyone has this mindset that they "can't" do this, or they "can't" do that. And I've lost enough times to know that no one actually gives a shit if you lose. But you're going to beat yourself up for every chance to improve your life you didn't take. So I would really hope that you would try to develop ways to encourage breaking the cycle of self victimization, especially when social media glorifies mental illness.

I believe every single person can get better,
But 90% won't. But again, some people get a sense of satisfaction from being the victim.
It's easy. But, I want to apologize to everyone who feels like this is condescending or insensitive. But if I choose to CTB it is a choice, and the only walls that we're back into are the ones we make ourselves. I just wish people would change their perspective before giving into suicidal behaviors.
But in order for more people to change their perspective... People in YOUR field need to change the narrative.

If people believe the lie they can't.
Then why can't they manifest the truth that they can?